CHIRP ATAB 50^TH MEETING – 6 JANUARY 2009

CE MEETING SUMMARY

CHIRP ATAB Agenda.

ITEM 4 - Matters Arising from Last Minutes

- The CAA ATSD still had the project to review and simplify the Loss comms procedure on its books and a meeting to progress it would take place in the next month.

- Security matters arising to be covered in the agenda.

- DDG versus MMEL usage – clarification has been sent to the airline concerned.

- Cabin crew FTL concerns are addressed and explained in the latest CHIRP feedback

ITEM 5.1 - Feedback on Issue 88

- Some discussion on the value of CHIRP had appeared in PRUNE which was considered by the Board. It was decided not to react to it on the website and let it die away.

ITEM 5.2 - Feedback on Issue 89 Draft – Nil

ITEM 6 – Reports for discussion

Engineer Report- E442

o Working time regulations allow 21 days straight working with 7 days off for contract workers– this was discussed extensively by the Board. The conclusion was that data on working times and rosters and there connection with safety accidents and incidents would be required to substantiate the problem and the case presented to the regulator. Data collection would be a challenge.

o Incident reporting by engineers has been poor and a n much more open approach to highlighting errors needs to be encouraged.

o SMS was seen as helpful in drawing out incident reports from the engineering fraternity but SMS was not seen as the panacea for getting the these issues addressed more formally

ATC Reports

ATC 693

o A no notice exercise involving a live flying situation to the practice loss of an aircraft at an ATC unit was carried out in which the controllers were unaware of the fact that it was not real.

o Although the intent not to pre-warn the controller of the exercise was seen as acceptable, so long as the appropriate supervision was in place, the concern was that insufficient duty of care was shown for the controllers involved: this was being dealt with directly by NATS.

o The Unit has been rebriefed and appropriate action taken.

o On a broader front, there are specific guidelines in the regulations which apply to flight deck practice emergencies which may provide a framework for ATC emergency exercises.

ATC 688

o Briefings for pilots on Wind reporting at airports has been addressed in CHIP Feedback Issue 89 as well as in articles in FOCUS and on the UKFSC website.

Ops Reports

o Pressure to dispatch – a Capt decides to override the MEL on an engine bleed problem in light of past experience in contravention of the AOC holders responsibilities and outside his scope of authority

o An airline has been erroneously using the DDG rather than the MEL to make dispatch decisions. The DDG can be used in conjunction with the MEL in specific circumstances agreed by the CAA.

o Company Fuel contingencies and planning were discussed extensively in light of several recent reports. One major concern was the potential misunderstanding which could arise from an aircraft captain informing ATC of his time left before divert. It was decided that a clear statement is needed which both flight deck and TC would understand and act upon.

o Concern was expressed by a Captain who was unable to read the print on new charts and plates and complained about the Chart manufacturers changing plate styles. The Chart companies generally consult with customers on changes and it may be that this had been done by the airline in question – With only 1 complaint so far, the Board decided to publish to see if other problems are out there.

o Three crew ops reports were discussed. Several variations appear to exist on quals required for the 3^rd pilot – indeed some are not legally allowed to touch the controls. The Board considered that the logic for 3 pilot ops needs to be revisited with the CAA. ICAO haS specific rules on quals and currency for pilots in such circumstances which should provide the clear guidelines as to the sensible way ahead.

o A report on a Fire extinguisher where a lock wire had been substituted for the pin!! If this had not been noticed prior to an incident, the results could have been catastrophic. The Board advocated the Pre-flight check of the extinguisher before each flight.

Security Report

o Transec have now been approached by SRG Group Director to sort out the safety issues arising from the security challenges and procedures to crews involved in operating aircraft from UK airports

o Transec will now accompany CAA inspectors around airports and see the methods being used by the security teams and the impact it is having on crews from a flight safety perspective.

o Some airline operators have misinterpreted a CAA statement and believe they do not want any security MORs – this is not the case!

o A DFT Presentation which provided the background to the Transec Policy was available on the UKFSC website for wider dissemination amongst pilots.

o Training of security personnel is the major target here – not the policy.

Other CHIRP Reports

o Lack of Sim training for Corporate Public transport. The Board decided that it needed to advocate the requirement for simulator training to be mandated for all corporate public transport and a n appropriate statement would be fabricated

o Minimum rest periods, insufficient reporting time to complete the necessary paperwork and NOTACS etc continue to be reported.

o Reports of poor CRM between flight deck and cabin crew continue to be regular features in reports

Next meeting 31 March 2009

Rich Jones

Chief Executive

UKFSC

7 January 2009